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Old 04-17-2005, 11:12 AM   #1
 
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Why do people take a perfectly good four wheeler with heat and a/c, and make a gutless, powerless rock crawler out of it? The hood, dash, and grill is usually all that remains when they decide to go get a real engine. I regress, but the 1.3L is great for a four wheeler. The predecessor to the Samurai was a small motorcyle engine with 1/3 the hp of the 1.3, and was designed for 4 wheeler type work.

Go ahead and take the old junk Chevy, Dodge, or Ford (plenty of them) and build a tube buggy around the engine and axles (or Jeep if you prefer). Leave what few good 4 wheelers are left alone!
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Old 04-17-2005, 11:24 AM   #2
 
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I can answer this one to a T. It started out with just wanting to put 33's on it and thinking I could go anywhere. Then it was dovetail the rear so some bigger tires would fit and I could move the axle back a little to make it more stable. That didnt last long cause the tires got into the fenders. Cut that off so no more problems with that. Then the front had to be tubed so the front tires could be moved forward for better approach angle and clearance. Once you get the big tires on it, the engine aint big enough anymore, so throw it in the trash and get a bigger one. And unlike a ford/chevy/dodge/jeep you still have the lightweight, the boxed frame and the cheap transfer case gearing options available. I couldnt have built any other rig this cheap and make it do what it will do. I am thinking by this time next year, I will have the front tubed nicely by myk, the engine will be a 2.0L with fuel injection and the tires will be around the 40"-42" range. Dont think it will be necessary to go with a larger tire then that. I will prolly keep the tub and the hood, they dont seem to be in the way as of right now, but if they rub me the wrong way, I will them off too. My zuk was one of the cleanest one I had seen when I got it 2 years ago. Would have made a fine daily driver for someone, but I messed that all up
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Old 04-17-2005, 11:25 AM   #3
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hmmm

As a man of questionable intelligence myself....
I have :
Cut the back end off a perfectly good Ramcharger.
Cut the front end off the same vehicle.
Took the A/C compressor and made it into an on board air compressor thereby sealing my fate during hot summer months.
Made the gearing so low it will never run on the highway again.
Register and insure it even though it will never see the highway again.
Helped others do unto their vehicles the same.

My thoughts are it is the thrill of a challenge, the excitement of impending change. Or maybe in some cases just changing it because they can.
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Old 04-17-2005, 11:33 AM   #4
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Old Goat, they change it because they are setting at home with nothing to do, and before they know it, it don't even look the same!
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Old 04-17-2005, 11:33 AM   #5
 
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Originally Posted by OldGoat
As a man of questionable intelligence myself....
I have :
Cut the back end off a perfectly good Ramcharger. (because it was in the way of the tires and the wheelbase that was needed to get where Stretch was able to go)
Cut the front end off the same vehicle. (So I could see where Stretch was leading me)
Took the A/C compressor and made it into an on board air compressor thereby sealing my fate during hot summer months. (Just so I can be like a zuk)
Made the gearing so low it will never run on the highway again. (So I could try to keep up with Stretch and not stall on those steep hills that Stretch is able to climb)
Register and insure it even though it will never see the highway again. (Stretch did it, so I figured I would too)
Helped others do unto their vehicles the same. (Yes you have)

My thoughts are it is the thrill of a challenge, the excitement of impending change. Or maybe in some cases just changing it because they can.
Exactly
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Old 04-17-2005, 12:41 PM   #6
 
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I have a good excuse: My engine was junk when I bought my non-running Sami. I stumbled onto a 1.8 Isuzu w/turbo 200 automatic for a price too cheap to pass up.

Everything went downhill from there.

And what am I pondering now? AFTER Memorial day, build a whole new frame wide enough for the 4.3, tweak my suspension a little (real heims etc.), move my axles to the new frame, put the STRAIGHT tub/hood/windshield frame I bought last week on the new frame and widen the body by 4" (using sections from the old stuff), do some more cage work. IF I do all this, I'll then only have a few things original Samurai: steering wheel, transfer case CASE, hard brake lines, gas tank, and hard fuel lines.
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Old 04-17-2005, 02:12 PM   #7
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sounds like an aful lot of work. I don't see why you run a sammi when nothing thaty is left is a sammi. ?????????????????? Everything on my blazer is still blazer with the exception of the axles, which still came from a chevrolet. Fourwheelerjeff and I have discused this for years.

BTW no offence to all you zuk guys. I think they are cool and all. And I agree they are very capable, but you have to do alot more to them than strong and capable.
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Old 04-17-2005, 02:29 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hatch
AFTER Memorial day, build a whole new frame wide enough for the 4.3, tweak my suspension a little (real heims etc.), move my axles to the new frame, put the STRAIGHT tub/hood/windshield frame I bought last week on the new frame and widen the body by 4" (using sections from the old stuff), do some more cage work. IF I do all this, I'll then only have a few things original Samurai: steering wheel, transfer case CASE, hard brake lines, gas tank, and hard fuel lines.
you mean after the SUMMER RUN @ K-Rocks, right
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Old 04-17-2005, 02:29 PM   #9
 
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sounds like an aful lot of work. I don't see why you run a sammi when nothing thaty is left is a sammi. ?????????????????? Everything on my blazer is still blazer with the exception of the axles, which still came from a chevrolet. Fourwheelerjeff and I have discused this for years.

BTW no offence to all you zuk guys. I think they are cool and all. And I agree they are very capable, but you have to do alot more to them than strong and capable.
Mine was very capable on 33's, 6:1 tcase and a lift, that was about all I did to it at first. only had about $3000 in it at that time. You cant even buy a fullsize rig for that little amount of money.

Think about how much you told me you spent on your axle swaps to 1ton stuff, gears lockers and so on. That is half of what I have in my whole zuk! So money wise, you cant beat em. I can buy 8:1 tcase gears for $1000, you cant even get 8:1's for a fullsize, the best you can do is an atlas with 5:1's for $2500. That leaves me $1500 to do alot of other stuff.

Not starting an argument, just pointing out facts. Plus the weight factor, the pulling the 6000lbs on a trailer vs. 2500 lbs. I can flop mine back over with 5 guys, vs a winch and another fullsize rig. There is pros and cons to both, but for me the zuk is the way to go. My zuk doesnt feel nearly as unstable as my bronco did.

Another thing. Half of the fun is building the rig the way you want it. If it already has a 350 and auto tranny and 1tons then it would be no fun for me. That is just me though.
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Old 04-17-2005, 02:34 PM   #10
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I see your point Clint. I'm not just talking about money, cause yes I have alot tied up in regearing my axles and the steering. But thats it. My engine has enough power than I will ever need and I didn't have to completely redesighn and fab all new suspension. I believe their is alot of advantages and disadvantages on both off them. Each to their own. Not only that how much fun would it be if we were all driving and wheeling the same thing?
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Old 04-17-2005, 02:35 PM   #11
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just so you know I have all the resect in the work for the work that everyone does on their rig. Just pointing out a point that I see.
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Old 04-17-2005, 02:58 PM   #12
 
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just so you know I have all the resect in the work for the work that everyone does on their rig. Just pointing out a point that I see.
oh I know. I wasnt agreeing or disagreeing with you. I see the benefits of both. Just for me the lighter weight and the fun of building it is what I like about the zuk. In all honesty, a jeep with the 4.0 staight 6, 4:1 tcase gears, dana 60's and 42's with hydraulic steering would be a perfect vehicle. But for the $30,000-$35,000 it would cost to get it that way, its not worth it to me.
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Old 04-17-2005, 03:22 PM   #13
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I guess I enjoying the building to much, I can't leave anything alone long enough to actual wheel.



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Old 04-17-2005, 03:25 PM   #14
 
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I guess I enjoying the building to much, I can't leave anything alone long enough to actual wheel.
I think I have the same problem.
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Old 04-17-2005, 04:02 PM   #15
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Quote:
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Mine was very capable on 33's only had about $3000 in it at that time. You cant even buy a fullsize rig for that little amount of money.

Think about how much you told me you spent on your axle swaps

Half of the fun is building the rig the way you want it. If it already has a 350 and auto tranny and 1tons then it would be no fun for me. That is just me though.

$3000........My fullsize was $1500 402BBC,4spd/205/d44/12 blt
3 yrs, lift,tires(33s) & a smaller moter later I 'might' have had $3k in it

3 yrs later-barely $3k more after countless bearings,u-joints,shafts, spider gears.....tires & such



As for axle swaps......that is $$ for everyone

I have yet to see a fullsize that 'needed' a 8:1 t-case

No....I dont need a auto to wheel.....wish I had one

Just standing up for the fullsize state-o-mind

But I wish I was as small/nimble as a lil Zuk
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Old 04-17-2005, 05:06 PM   #16
 
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My answer to the whole question:

"why not? "
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Old 04-17-2005, 06:00 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Stretch
In all honesty, a jeep with the 4.0 staight 6, 4:1 tcase gears, dana 60's and 42's with hydraulic steering would be a perfect vehicle.

nah.. tires too small.
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Old 04-17-2005, 06:04 PM   #18
 
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nah.. tires too small.
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Old 04-17-2005, 06:13 PM   #19
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mudnmyvayne
$3000........My fullsize was $1500 402BBC,4spd/205/d44/12 blt
3 yrs, lift,tires(33s) & a smaller moter later I 'might' have had $3k in it

3 yrs later-barely $3k more after countless bearings,u-joints,shafts, spider gears.....tires & such



As for axle swaps......that is $$ for everyone

I have yet to see a fullsize that 'needed' a 8:1 t-case

No....I dont need a auto to wheel.....wish I had one

Just standing up for the fullsize state-o-mind

But I wish I was as small/nimble as a lil Zuk

Then how does atlas and klune v stay in business??? axle swaps are more expensive on a fullsize truck, a d60 will cost you $1000 just for the axle which needs everything on it replaced. I bought a d44 and 12 bolt for $75 and replaced $500 worth of stuff in it. You still dont have a rear axle in the fullsize rig yet!!! and I'm done with axles.
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Old 04-17-2005, 07:06 PM   #20
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Then how does atlas and klune v stay in business??? axle swaps are more expensive on a fullsize truck, a d60 will cost you $1000 just for the axle which needs everything on it replaced. I bought a d44 and 12 bolt for $75 and replaced $500 worth of stuff in it. You still dont have a rear axle in the fullsize rig yet!!! and I'm done with axles.

yeah but that 44/12 combo isn't gonna hold up to 42's or 44's very long even if your truck only weighs 2500lbs. Eventually if you want to step up to the bigger tires you are gonna need the bigger axles. Then you are gonna be in the same boat as the rest of us.

give it up you can't win for losin. I will admit their has been times I've thought about starting over with nothing but my axles and tires. for something smaller, narrowed, lighter.

this could go on forever. kinda like whats the best wheelbase.
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Old 04-17-2005, 07:15 PM   #21
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Then how does atlas and klune v stay in business???

Jeeps, EBs, Scouts, TLCs, etc. etc.



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Old 04-17-2005, 07:17 PM   #22
 
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yeah but that 44/12 combo isn't gonna hold up to 42's or 44's very long even if your truck only weighs 2500lbs. Eventually if you want to step up to the bigger tires you are gonna need the bigger axles. Then you are gonna be in the same boat as the rest of us.

give it up you can't win for losin. I will admit their has been times I've thought about starting over with nothing but my axles and tires. for something smaller, narrowed, lighter.

this could go on forever. kinda like whats the best wheelbase.
ah yes, but my 37's will get me anywhere the 42's on a fullsize rig will go. now that you mention it, what is the perfect wheelbase??? ya, i like my tires sticking out way past the body, I can see where 3 of them are at all the time. the front passenger tire is the only one I cant see. and I can see over the hood unlike a fullsize rig. 8.9 gallons of gas will carry me for days of wheelin. that 350 is gonna suck 8.9 gallons in about 5 minutes. If I was to do it again. If I was gonna start from scratch, I would go with unimog axles (ultimate in ground clearance), tube buggy, vortec v6, 5:1 atlas, auto tranny, and 40" Krawlers. That would be a pretty cool buggy in my opinion. Hmmm, let me go talk to my wife real quick and see what she thinks.
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Old 04-17-2005, 07:19 PM   #23
 
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Jeeps, EBs, Scouts, TLCs, etc. etc.
You left out Ramchargers and K5's. I know two people personally that have these in there rig or on order!!!!
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Old 04-17-2005, 07:24 PM   #24
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I was just saying that is the bulk of their businesss, since you asked how they stay in business. Not to say that there are fullsize rigs running one of the other or both, just most are sold to smaller rigs.



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Old 04-17-2005, 07:27 PM   #25
 
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Just thinking outloud.

Tube Chassis $2000
Atlas II 5:1 $2500
Auto Tranny $500
Vortec V6 $1000
D60 Front $1500
14FF Rear $500
Suspension $1500
Hydro Steer $500
Misc. $2000
Beadlocks $800
Tires $1000
Warn 9500 $1000

$14,800 for my dream setup!!!
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